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Docs: Using Python on a Macintosh has bad info per Apple site #77005

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griswolf mannequin opened this issue Feb 11, 2018 · 9 comments
Open

Docs: Using Python on a Macintosh has bad info per Apple site #77005

griswolf mannequin opened this issue Feb 11, 2018 · 9 comments
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@ned-deily
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3.9 only security fixes 3.10 only security fixes 3.11 only security fixes docs Documentation in the Doc dir OS-mac type-feature A feature request or enhancement

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@griswolf
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Mannequin

griswolf mannequin commented Feb 11, 2018

BPO 32824
Nosy @ronaldoussoren, @ned-deily, @remilapeyre, @tomy0000000

Note: these values reflect the state of the issue at the time it was migrated and might not reflect the current state.

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GitHub fields:

assignee = 'https://github.com/ned-deily'
closed_at = None
created_at = <Date 2018-02-11.23:42:34.211>
labels = ['OS-mac', '3.9', '3.10', '3.11', 'type-feature', 'docs']
title = 'Docs: Using Python on a Macintosh has bad info per Apple site'
updated_at = <Date 2021-04-29.13:39:59.899>
user = 'https://bugs.python.org/griswolf'

bugs.python.org fields:

activity = <Date 2021-04-29.13:39:59.899>
actor = 'Old Sub Sailor'
assignee = 'ned.deily'
closed = False
closed_date = None
closer = None
components = ['Documentation', 'macOS']
creation = <Date 2018-02-11.23:42:34.211>
creator = 'griswolf'
dependencies = []
files = []
hgrepos = []
issue_num = 32824
keywords = []
message_count = 8.0
messages = ['312023', '312028', '368542', '368545', '368548', '368558', '392259', '392307']
nosy_count = 8.0
nosy_names = ['ronaldoussoren', 'ned.deily', 'griswolf', 'docs@python', 'Old Sub Sailor', 'remi.lapeyre', 'TotallyLost', 'tomy0000000']
pr_nums = []
priority = 'high'
resolution = None
stage = 'needs patch'
status = 'open'
superseder = None
type = 'enhancement'
url = 'https://bugs.python.org/issue32824'
versions = ['Python 3.9', 'Python 3.10', 'Python 3.11']
@griswolf
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griswolf mannequin commented Feb 11, 2018

This chunk of docs has bad info in both Python2 and Python3 docs:

4.1.3. Configuration

Python on OS X honors all standard Unix environment variables such as PYTHONPATH, but setting these variables for programs started from the Finder is non-standard as the Finder does not read your .profile or .cshrc at startup. You need to create a file ~/.MacOSX/environment.plist. See Apple’s Technical Document QA1067 for details.

If you search for QA1067, you are informed that the document is legacy and unsupported, with a suggestion for where to look now. That suggested link leads to a 404.

Searching the apple site, I find that at least some thoughtful developers think that configuring the environment isn't even possible, generally; and isn't considered good form even if so. Here:
https://forums.developer.apple.com/message/217422

I have no problem setting things for my terminal, as a longtime (unix) user, but for others, this section probably needs a complete examination with an eye toward making it current. quite possibly by reorganizing it.

@griswolf griswolf mannequin assigned docspython Feb 11, 2018
@griswolf griswolf mannequin added docs Documentation in the Doc dir type-feature A feature request or enhancement labels Feb 11, 2018
@ned-deily
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Thanks for the reminder. Yes, the whole "Using Python on a Macintosh" section is very much out-of-date and needs a complete rewrite. It has been on my To Do list for a long time; I'll see what I can do to expedite it.

@ned-deily ned-deily added 3.7 (EOL) end of life 3.8 only security fixes labels Feb 12, 2018
@ned-deily ned-deily assigned ned-deily and unassigned docspython Feb 12, 2018
@TotallyLost
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TotallyLost mannequin commented May 9, 2020

So, how do we wake this sleeping concern up?

@remilapeyre
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remilapeyre mannequin commented May 9, 2020

Hi Gleen, the best way forward is to propose an improvement to the current documentation. It will get reviewed and merge if appropriate.

The source for this part is at https://github.com/python/cpython/blob/master/Doc/using/mac.rst and you can find the information needed to contribute in the Python Dev Guide: https://devguide.python.org/.

@OldSubSailor
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OldSubSailor mannequin commented May 9, 2020

Thank you Remi

On May 9, 2020, at 4:15 PM, Rémi Lapeyre <report@bugs.python.org> wrote:

Rémi Lapeyre <remi.lapeyre@henki.fr> added the comment:

Hi Gleen, the best way forward is to propose an improvement to the current documentation. It will get reviewed and merge if appropriate.

The source for this part is at https://github.com/python/cpython/blob/master/Doc/using/mac.rst and you can find the information needed to contribute in the Python Dev Guide: https://devguide.python.org/.

----------
nosy: +remi.lapeyre

Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org>
<https://bugs.python.org/issue32824\>

@OldSubSailor
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OldSubSailor mannequin commented May 10, 2020

Thank you, but how in the world does one know where to look or find that document at github. I tried to search earlier and got hundreds of listings for python doc.

Sent from my iPhone

On May 9, 2020, at 16:36, Glenn Travis <pbfuddle@comcast.net> wrote:

Thank you Remi

> On May 9, 2020, at 4:15 PM, Rémi Lapeyre <report@bugs.python.org> wrote:
>
>
> Rémi Lapeyre <remi.lapeyre@henki.fr> added the comment:
>
> Hi Gleen, the best way forward is to propose an improvement to the current documentation. It will get reviewed and merge if appropriate.
>
> The source for this part is at https://github.com/python/cpython/blob/master/Doc/using/mac.rst and you can find the information needed to contribute in the Python Dev Guide: https://devguide.python.org/.
>
> ----------
> nosy: +remi.lapeyre
>
> _______________________________________
> Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org>
> <https://bugs.python.org/issue32824\>
> _______________________________________

@iritkatriel iritkatriel added 3.9 only security fixes 3.10 only security fixes 3.11 only security fixes and removed 3.7 (EOL) end of life 3.8 only security fixes labels Apr 28, 2021
@OldSubSailor
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OldSubSailor mannequin commented Apr 28, 2021

I see that this remains alive. I do have a newer question. Apple continues to say that they are going to drop all their included versions of python and I believe ruby in some future version of macOS. I thought that this would happen in Big Sur, but python versions 2.7.16 still remains with us, why, I don’t know.

On Apr 28, 2021, at 3:21 PM, Irit Katriel <report@bugs.python.org> wrote:

Change by Irit Katriel <iritkatriel@yahoo.com>:

----------
versions: +Python 3.10, Python 3.11, Python 3.9 -Python 2.7, Python 3.6, Python 3.7, Python 3.8

Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org>
<https://bugs.python.org/issue32824\>

@OldSubSailor
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OldSubSailor mannequin commented Apr 29, 2021

Here is a copy of the Apple Python call as of April 29, 2021. To my way of thinking it seems that Apple is saying that someday they will indeed eliminate all the included “scripting” software from macOS and they further imply that one should install an. Up-to-date version of one’s particular chosen software.

Last login: Thu Apr 29 08:22:47 on console
% python

WARNING: Python 2.7 is not recommended.
This version is included in macOS for compatibility with legacy software.
Future versions of macOS will not include Python 2.7.
Instead, it is recommended that you transition to using 'python3' from within Terminal.

Python 2.7.16 (default, Feb 28 2021, 12:34:25) 
[GCC Apple LLVM 12.0.5 (clang-1205.0.19.59.6) [+internal-os, ptrauth-isa=deploy on darwin
Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
>>> exit()
% exit
Saving session...
...copying shared history...
...saving history...truncating history files...
...completed.

[Process completed]

On Apr 28, 2021, at 4:25 PM, Glenn Travis <report@bugs.python.org> wrote:

Glenn Travis <pbfuddle@comcast.net> added the comment:

I see that this remains alive. I do have a newer question. Apple continues to say that they are going to drop all their included versions of python and I believe ruby in some future version of macOS. I thought that this would happen in Big Sur, but python versions 2.7.16 still remains with us, why, I don’t know.

> On Apr 28, 2021, at 3:21 PM, Irit Katriel <report@bugs.python.org> wrote:
>
>
> Change by Irit Katriel <iritkatriel@yahoo.com>:
>
>
> ----------
> versions: +Python 3.10, Python 3.11, Python 3.9 -Python 2.7, Python 3.6, Python 3.7, Python 3.8
>
> _______________________________________
> Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org>
> <https://bugs.python.org/issue32824\>
> _______________________________________

----------

Python tracker <report@bugs.python.org>
<https://bugs.python.org/issue32824\>

@ezio-melotti ezio-melotti transferred this issue from another repository Apr 10, 2022
@soegaard
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A start would be to remove the sentence:

"See Apple’s Technical Document QA1067 for details."

Since as @griswold points out, you are met with the sentece:

Note: Legacy Document

This document is part of the Legacy section of the ADC Reference Library. This information should not be used for new development.

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