Author taleinat
Recipients rhettinger, taleinat, terry.reedy, xtreak
Date 2018-11-10.22:12:40
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Message-id <1541887960.51.0.788709270274.issue35196@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
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Raymond, thanks for bringing up all of these issues.  This kind of input from people using IDLE extensively for teaching is extremely useful.  I'll leave it to Terry to decide how to manage this list, but I promise to do my best (with my limited time) to resolve the worst of these.

A few quick notes:

> However, recently a student got into a new-tabbed mode and there didn't seem to be any way to turn it off.  It became impossible to see code and output or error messages at the same time.  This devastated the learner's experience.

This sounds like macOS's new "Prefer tabs when opening documents" system preference, which breaks IDLE in various ways; see issue34864.  It should be disabled when using IDLE.

> FWIW, I think the squeezer focused on the wrong problem.  In general, I've never had a problem with too many *lines* of output. [...]  The real problem with IDLE was excessive wide output on a *single* line [...]  That tends to cripple IDLE because line wrap logic seems to be computationally expensive for scrolling text windows.  The effect persists even after the offending text has scrolled off and is no longer visible.

This is exactly the main rationale for Squeezer; it takes wrapping into account when counting lines precisely for this reason.  This may not be working properly in some cases due to issue35208, which I discovered only yesterday and for which a PR is now ready with a fix.
History
Date User Action Args
2018-11-10 22:12:40taleinatsetrecipients: + taleinat, rhettinger, terry.reedy, xtreak
2018-11-10 22:12:40taleinatsetmessageid: <1541887960.51.0.788709270274.issue35196@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
2018-11-10 22:12:40taleinatlinkissue35196 messages
2018-11-10 22:12:40taleinatcreate