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Green-box doc glitch: winhelp version only #49638

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terryjreedy opened this issue Feb 27, 2009 · 12 comments
Closed

Green-box doc glitch: winhelp version only #49638

terryjreedy opened this issue Feb 27, 2009 · 12 comments
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docs Documentation in the Doc dir

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@terryjreedy
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BPO 5388
Nosy @birkenfeld, @terryjreedy, @ezio-melotti
Files
  • Py31doc.jpg: Scrollbar in grammar box
  • py31doc.png: No scrollbars in grammar box
  • py31doc-vista.png: Scrollbar on Vista
  • py31doc-win2k3.png: Scrollbar on Win2k3 Server
  • py31doc-winxpsp2.png: No scrollbars on WinXP SP2
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    Note: these values reflect the state of the issue at the time it was migrated and might not reflect the current state.

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    GitHub fields:

    assignee = None
closed_at = None
created_at = <Date 2009-02-27.19:45:52.680>
labels = ['docs']
title = 'Green-box doc glitch: winhelp version only'
updated_at = <Date 2013-10-11.18:59:58.192>
user = 'https://github.com/terryjreedy'

    bugs.python.org fields:

    activity = <Date 2013-10-11.18:59:58.192>
actor = 'terry.reedy'
assignee = 'docs@python'
closed = False
closed_date = None
closer = None
components = ['Documentation']
creation = <Date 2009-02-27.19:45:52.680>
creator = 'terry.reedy'
dependencies = []
files = ['14388', '14412', '14414', '14416', '14417']
hgrepos = []
issue_num = 5388
keywords = []
message_count = 10.0
messages = ['82863', '89780', '89784', '89788', '89867', '89956', '89961', '89963', '199491', '199498']
nosy_count = 3.0
nosy_names = ['georg.brandl', 'terry.reedy', 'ezio.melotti']
pr_nums = []
priority = 'low'
resolution = None
stage = None
status = 'open'
superseder = None
type = None
url = 'https://bugs.python.org/issue5388'
versions = ['Python 3.3', 'Python 3.4']
    @terryjreedy
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    Example: LangRef / LexAnalysis / Identifiers

    Green-shaded grammar section has 3 lines, 2 very long:

    identifier ::= id_start id_continue*
    id_start ::= <all characters in general categories Lu, ...
    id_continue ::= <all characters in id_start, plus character ...

    so both online html and winhelp versions have a horizontal scroll bar
    underneath.

    The 3.0.1 Windows Help version only displays 2 lines and adds a mini
    vertical scroll bar at the far right to see the third. If possible, it
    would be better if it simply displayed 3 lines like the html version.

    Experimentation indicates the following for all the green boxes: if the
    type size is increased or the window narrowed so that a horizontal
    scroll bar is needed, html (at least as rendered by FireFox) adds it
    *underneath* the green box, while Winhelp adds it *in* the green box,
    taking up one line and thus hiding the last line of text, thus requiring
    a vertical scroll to see that line, which then hides the top line (ugh).

    Assuming that there is no configuration option or formatting directive
    that can be put in the file to tell winhelp to act differently, a
    partial fix would be to add an extra blank line, if possible, to every
    green box on conversion to the winhelp version so that all lines would
    be visible even when an (now irrelevant) vscroll appears.

    @terryjreedy terryjreedy added the docs Documentation in the Doc dir label Feb 27, 2009
    @ezio-melotti
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    It's probably better to split long lines (at 80 chars?) than adding an
    empty line in every box. Scrolling horizontally is annoying enough even
    without the problem you mentioned.

    I don't know if it's possible to split grammar lines like
    id_start/id_continue1, but in this specific case is probably better to
    keep the definitions short and explain it further in the following
    paragraph.

    I don't have any idea about how Windows Help works, but if it uses
    something like CSS, some extra padding at bottom could solve the problem
    without having to add an empty line.

    @terryjreedy
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    The lines in the green box do not have to be long in an absolute sense,
    just longer than the current window width allows. As soon as the the
    window is narrow enough to require a horizontal scroll bar, a vertical
    scroll bar is added too because the horizonal scroll bar is added into
    the box on top of where the bottom margin and part of the last line was.

    I just discovered that if the vertical scroll bar is exactly centered,
    everything is visible because the horizontal bar is a bit under twice
    the width of the top and bottom margins. If only it started there...

    @ezio-melotti
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    That's why I think that the Windows Help problem still need to be fixed,
    but limiting the length of the lines is a good idea regardless of this,
    since having long lines and horizontal scroll bars is annoying on the
    browser too.

    Is the Windows Help python31.chm?
    I installed Python 3.1 on Windows XP and tried to open that section.
    Here the width of the page depends on the longest line, so the whole
    page is large enough to contain both id_start and id_continue (however,
    even if this long lines go over the right limit of the page, all the
    other lines fit in the visible part of the page). There are no
    scrollbars inside the green box, just "global" scrollbars for the page

    @terryjreedy
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    WinXP, updated, Py3.1.
    Start / Programs / Python3.1 / Python Docs
    I presume this uses .chm file.
    I most definitely have scrollbars covering text in green box.
    See screenshot for what I see.

    @ezio-melotti
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    This is what I see here (see attached image). The only scrollbar is the
    one at the bottom for the whole page. The file is under Start ->
    Programs -> Python 3.1 -> Python Manuals, and the path/file is
    C:\Programs\Python31\Doc\python31.chm (you can see it right-clicking on
    it from start menu and selecting properties).

    I'm using WinXP SP2, the versions of the HTML Help Components are:
    HHCTRL.OCX 5.02.3790.2453
    ITSS.DLL 5.02.3790.2453
    ITIRCL.DLL 5.02.3790.2453
    HHA.DLL 4.74.8702.0

    Compiled with HHA Version 4.74.8702

    You can find this information right-clicking on WinHelp in the
    application bar (or on the small icon on the left of the title bar) and
    then on "Version...". Maybe you are running an older (or newer) version
    of WinHelp.

    Tomorrow I'll check with some other Windows.

    @terryjreedy
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    Same path to python31.chm.
    I presume color difference is due to difference selections in
    Display Properties / Appearance tab.

    When I left- or right-click on upper-left icon as depicted in screen
    capture, choices are move, resize, ...., close, About HTML Help. No
    Versions. Result of selecting last is popup window

    About Microsoft HTML Help.
    Html Help Control Version 5.2.3790.4110
    Copyright blah blah

    Ditto for right-click on entry in task bar as bottom of screen.

    Other programs use the same control.

    We are obviously running different 'help' programs. WinHelp versus HTML
    Help? I wonder if it has anything to do with vendor customization. My XP
    Home is from HP. However, wife's machine from Dell with XP Pro uses the
    same version of same control for help with various programs also.

    My machine does have winhelp.exe (with pure ? icon instead of ? and
    page) and winhelp32.exe (with ? on book cover icon), but they are not
    listed in programs / accessories. Latter does not recognize python31.chm
    as a help file. The former looks for .hlp files.

    @ezio-melotti
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    I uploaded a few more screenshots.
    I was able to reproduce the issue on Vista with HTML Help Version 6.0
    and on Windows 2003 Server whit HTML Help Control Version 5.2.3790.3959.
    I also tried on another Windows XP SP2 machine with HTML Help Control
    Version 5.2.3790.1194 but the scrollbar wasn't there, so I guess they
    changed something between .1194 and .3959
    The version I'm running at home is probably even older (4.74?) and the
    problem seems to affect only the newer versions.

    @admin admin mannequin assigned docspython and unassigned birkenfeld Oct 29, 2010
    @birkenfeld
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    Is this still an issue?

    @terryjreedy
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    Yes. On win 7, html help control 6.1, the horizontal scroll bar is still put in or on top of the box, but it is thinner so it only cuts off half of the bottom line instead of hiding it completely. There is no longer a vertical scroll bar, which means one can only expose the rest of the bottom line by maximizing the window and shrinking the type size.

    This is no an issue for me now because I recently got a 27' monitor with 2560x1440 resolution, so with full screen and still readable type, I can see even the long lines discussed here without a scrollbar. But this will not be true for most. On a small enough screen, I might need a magnifier.

    I checked and Internet Explorer works like FireFox, adding the scrollbar beneath the box (or expanding the box to accommodate it).

    I just confirmed that the start menu shortcut does the same as double clicking python34/Doc/python34a3.chm. Same behavior. The icon is question mark partly over page.

    @ezio-melotti ezio-melotti transferred this issue from another repository Apr 10, 2022
    @CAM-Gerlach
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    This appears to display correctly in all supported online HTML versions of the docs and the ancient Windows CHM help has been dropped as of 3.11, so can this be closed now?

    @arhadthedev
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    3.11 (the only bugfix branch) removed the Windows Help files so closing.

    @arhadthedev arhadthedev closed this as not planned Won't fix, can't repro, duplicate, stale Apr 20, 2023
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